Suzuki GSXR 750 quad Throttle Body Install on 2.3 L Duratec

[duckmans]

If you add some motor mounts do you think that would help with clearance? I mean the motor would not move as much so you would not have to worry as much right?

[JohnStranahan]

the center two ports are only off from the throttle bodies about 1/4 inch. The outside two ports are off 3/4 inch. I plan to correct this offset by angling the short tubes coming out of the manifold and by porting where possible.

The stiff urethane motor mounts would give me more clearance at the front. I thought about those.
John

[Focus_wrc07]

That sounds great. I hope the angling, and porting works out.

The urethane mounts I couldn't say though, because I haven't done anything with them. I wanted to put them in my old car, when I busted my tranny, and and rear motor mounts, but I couldn't.

[JohnStranahan]

The variance for the end throttle bodies is 3/4 inch narrower for the Zusuki Throttle bodies center of body to center of port. The two center bodies are only 1/4 inch off. I will make up the difference on the outer throttle bodies by offsetting, angling, and porting the outer plastic manifold runner tube.
Some of the hardware is trickling in. One thing I plan to add is a triangular brace to positively locate the rubber tube mounted throttle bodies. Two bolts with these long inserts will secure this brace to the manifold flange. The long inserts require a 9 mm hole for an M6 bolt. They turn in with a hex driver. The short inserts are tapped in with a hammer. I will only use those if space is a problem. The tubular sleeves will take the compression forces from the through bolts and expand slightly to hold the through bolts better. My 2 inch plastic ABS runner tube has not arrived.
John

[phongshader]

You should check out http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk they have a lot of people there converting bike itbs for automotive use like this thread http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/view....php?tid=39872.
Also the gixxer itbs unbolt from each other and you can add spacers between the tbs to get the correct spacing. That would make the intake manifold easier to build much more efficient, less bends before the port.

[JohnStranahan]

Thanks for the links. The GXR throttle bodies do unbolt, but the secondary throttle plate shaft is one piece. You would have to cut this shaft and make couplers or build a new shaft. Then you would also have to make extenders for the primary throttle body linkages. That 3/4 inch spacing difference is also going to be essential on the Duratec 2.3 To clear the power steering pump with the linkage. I did consider the ramifications of spacing these bodies out.
The Mr. Gasket Bell Crank, although a bit large, fit the plastic Suzuki bushing on the shaft well. This arm will rotate free on the shaft and engage a second arm placed on top of it. This second arm will be setscrewed to the shaft. The two vacuum actuating butterfly motors will act on these arms. I think I will have space for these next to the powersteering pump because of the offset bores.
John
phongshader. I took a look at your second link. A cast manifold would be so cool. How about an ABS manifold CNC'd from 2 inch billet. That would be cool too. Both beyond my means. My ABS manifold might be a good prototype though.
Deagle50AE-Thanks.

[Focus_wrc07]

Looking nice John. I'm glad to hear that the project's still on with parts trickling in.

The manifold would be awesome in billet, or cast, but it would be very costly to build the prototype for this project. That's the part that sucks.

How are the inserts working? They looked like they would work rather well, and if nothing else, how about those heli-coils?

[phongshader]

Where are you located? If you're making the intake manifold out of abs you should look into this http://www.techshop.ws They have abs 3d rapid prototyping machine that can print out your design from a cad file. Membership is $30 a day, $100 a month, and $1200 a year. I'm not affiliated with them in any way I just think it's a great resource for a fabricator on a budget. I'm planning to use this for printing out a mold for a foam positive for lost foam casting aluminum for my adaptation of gixxer tbs. Got a question, can abs handle the heat cycles? Won't abs get too soft if it's heated up possibly deforming? If the answer is no then I may just forgo the mold and just print out the manifold.

[JohnStranahan]

I don't have the CAD either. Sounds exciting though. Good luck.
Here is some info on ABS. The softening point is 200 F. (it is possible that they use a slightly higher temp plastic at Ford) So how does Ford keep their manifold from melting. Well it is from non contact and air cooling. The manifold does not really touch the head to any great degree. There are seals that touch the head and the manifold and prevent most contact. There is a natural cooling that ocurs when air expands after the throttle body. There is also considerable cooling that occurs to the intake manifold surface in the head by the proximity of the fuel injection spray.
Consider this an experiment. I don't know if my ABS will stay sealed or not. I suspect that with a gasket similar to what I have shown and blue silicone sealer that I won't have a problem.
You do need to use fastening techniques suitable for plastic. The main problem is that plastic is slow flowing liquid. It will flow away from bolt pressure. This is the reason for the inserts and large section thickness of the manifold that I have planned.

I would certainly try to just print out a manifold. They may even have access to a wider range of plastics than I do.
John
Houston, Texas, USA

[PCP_TwilightZX3]

bump need more update

[Focus_wrc07]

Twilight, thanks for the bump on this thread. I was actually thinking of it the other day, and was wondering how this project was coming along.

[JohnStranahan]

The manifold is underway. I just received ABS pipe a couple of weeks ago. I have a 2 inch forstner bit to drill the manifold flange. I'll post pics in a week or two.

[Focus_wrc07]

John, thanks for the update as far as posting pics, and progress. We'll be waiting.

[Europeanfocus]

Very good job! excelent! Good luck to all your mods!

[JohnStranahan]

Work proceeds on 3/18/2008
The nephew is at hand and work proceeds. We made an 8 mm pilot from .5 inch drill rod. Drilled it .125 then .128 for a light fit of a 1.25 inch transfer punch. We used this and the gasket template to center punch the mounting holes. These were then center punched with a larger punch. The photo shows the pilot and center punch laying on the ABS plastic flange. The wiggler is installed in the milling machine (or large drill press) to drill the holes out for smooth metal inserts.

The next step is drilling 2 inch giant angled holes in the flange. Picture to come this week.


We made an 8mm pilot for a .125 in center punch. We used this to center punch the manifold flange attachment bolts. Use a wiggler to align the mill or drill head to the punch mark.

john

[Egz]

Ah, good to see that you are still working on it. Keep up the good work.

[vin0410]

Go Go! John. Have you realized how many people are after your project?

[Focus_wrc07]

I'm jealous. I wish I had the tools, and resources at hand that you do.

Thanks for the update, and new pic sir. Please keep it posted.

I would like to do this to my car, but I don't have the resources, time, or tools to do this. I just want to see someone prove everyone that said it couldn't be done, wrong.

[SawtoothSam]

Saw this on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/FORD-DURATEC-DCOE-T-BODIES-INLET-MANIFOLD-1-8-2-0-2-3_W0QQitemZ250226147044QQihZ015QQcategoryZ72205QQr dZ1QQssPageNameZWD2VQQcmdZViewItem?_trksid=p1638.m 122#ebayphotohosting
It may or may not simplify your installation but the price seems very reasonable. Not sure how much shipping would be to this side of the pond (to the US).

I am considering a similar DIY ITB setup to swap a 2.3l Duratec into a 63 sunbeam alpine. I think, however I am going to use a 3rd party ecu and ignition system. But, if your swap with the stock ecu and egr stuff turns out OK, I may try that path. I was thinking, to use the existing injector ports on the suzuki ITBs for nos fogger nozzles, so I am unsure how I could plumb the egr.

[JohnStranahan]

Thanks for the posts and encouragement.

I took a look at that cast manifold. It looks nice. The runners are too long for the Suzuki throttle bodies. You would have little room for the trumpets which are already very short. Good luck.

We are setting up for the big 2 inch bores. I might take a short video. We plan to use coolant to insure that the plastic does not friction weld to the cutter tips and make a mess. This may not be a problem, but since I have the coolant we will be using it.

John

[Focus_wrc07]

John, please enlighten me. Which cast manifold are you referring to? I can't recall any cast manifold, but remember you talking about getting another stock manifold. Is that what you're talking about. I can't remember. It's been a long day/week.

[Egz]

He's referring to the eBay ad one post above his posted by SawtoothSam.

[Focus_wrc07]

Egz, thanks for the enlightenment, but I still don't see it.

[Egz]

[Focus_wrc07]

Thanks Egz. I didn't see it before, and now I do. Some of the pics my computer at work, and some times at home won't come up for some reason. The pic you posted is there though.