My solid Duratec passenger motor mount

[sporadic]

I've been itching to make a solid passenger mount since getting such significant wheel hop at the track.
I already have poly driver and tranny(dogbone) mounts.
This may end up being a track-only part if the vibration is too significant.
I will most likely leave it installed for daily driving.
I've had solid mounts in other cars, and the added vibration just doesn't bother me.
This is my own design with no ideas derived from anyone else.
The mount is appx 1/4" steel MIG welded.
The steel was scavanged from a 3-ton and 2-ton hydraulic jack lift arms.
I will add a layer of rubber between each of the mounting points before the final install.

The car is not on the road yet after a heart transplant.
I'll post my thoughts on the mount after I get some miles on it.

Progress pics:







Finished product:

[KingCrabb]

i would even that out and make a solid driver side mount as well or u may start breaking things. and if i were u wouldnt make a solid lower mount or u Will break ur tranny case, i seen it happen twice.

[sporadic]

Originally Posted by KingCrabb

i would even that out and make a solid driver side mount as well or u may start breaking things. and if i were u wouldnt make a solid lower mount or u Will break ur tranny case, i seen it happen twice.

What vehicles did you see break the tranny case?
I've had solid, or practically solid tranny mounts on other cars with no problem with 75k hard miles on it afterwards.
I don't intend to make a solid driver's side mount since I already have a poly.
What do you think exactly will start breaking if I don't have a matching solid?

[KingCrabb]

im talking on the focus. iv seen two ppl who have made solid lower mounts and broke the tranny case where the lower mount mounts to the tranny. it would be fine on the street but as soon as u try and hit those 2.0 and lower 60s things will start to break.

[sporadic]

Originally Posted by KingCrabb

im talking on the focus. iv seen two ppl who have made solid lower mounts and broke the tranny case where the lower mount mounts to the tranny. it would be fine on the street but as soon as u try and hit those 2.0 and lower 60s things will start to break.

This is interesting.
Do you know if those people had the other 2 mounts solid, or just the dogbone?

[KingCrabb]

just the dog bone. and poly upper mounts. i wanted to make one and i started a thread on FF and two different ppl told me no and showed me pictures of what happened when they did.
i used to have real bad wheel hop but when i got all my poly mounts and lowering springs it kinda went away.

[247_racing_zx3]

I made a solid passenger and ended up bending/snapping it after a year of abuse. Keep that stock one handy.

[sporadic]

Originally Posted by 247_racing_zx3

I made a solid passenger and ended up bending/snapping it after a year of abuse. Keep that stock one handy.

No offense, but mine looks far more stout than yours.
Your primary support is on the lateral bars which aren't what takes the abuse.
I think the cam cover would break before my mount.

[sleeperlove]

Originally Posted by sporadic

No offense, but mine looks far more stout than yours.
Your primary support is on the lateral bars which aren't what takes the abuse.
I think the cam cover would break before my mount.

No offense but yours looks like its going to fall apart as well. You expect just the welds and no gusset to hold the weight of the engine?

I applaud the ingenuity, but it doesn't look at all like it will hold up to me.

[sporadic]

Originally Posted by sleeperlove

No offense but yours looks like its going to fall apart as well. You expect just the welds and no gusset to hold the weight of the engine?

I applaud the ingenuity, but it doesn't look at all like it will hold up to me.

Actually I did, but I see what you mean.
I might just add a couple supports there. Thanks.

[BowDown]

Your mount will fail. Butt joint mig welds are not going to hold your engine in place. That's alot of ask of that configuration! You are going to need to add alot more material to have a chance at that mount holding up.

[sporadic]

I appreciate constructive, specific feedback. Keep it coming.

[BowDown]

I would suggest making the arms on either side 1 piece. Do you have access to a Parana? Then bridge the arms together with one top and one bottom plate. You're still going to want to brace in the inside radius of every bend.

With the middle support piece I would suggest starting from the bridge at the top and bend down to a middle cross support then bend down to catch the middle anchor bolt.

Just cutting a piece of steel, setting another piece at a 90 from it and running a mig weld isn't going to cut it. The motor rocks back and forth. It's just going to stress crack that weld and break off.

[247_racing_zx3]

Originally Posted by sporadic

No offense, but mine looks far more stout than yours.
Your primary support is on the lateral bars which aren't what takes the abuse.
I think the cam cover would break before my mount.

I'm sure using 1 piece L brackets for top support can take a good amount of abuse. No offense but all your ends are held up with welds, so your mount is basically going to rely on the welds to hold everything together. Maybe you would want to consider a V2 with a more thought out design.

[bhw752k]

247_racing_zx3's mount uses L brackets, which are vastly stronger than flat beams when it comes to bending. This is due to the immensely superior second moment of area. Even then, his bracket still failed.

When you look at your photos comparing your mount to the stock one, the difference in both design and material mass is pretty startling. Furthermore, the stock mount is made using a compressible material which deflects under load. If critical forces and moments are applied to a rigid body, it will crack abruptly instead of deflecting.

Granted, the stock mount is certainly designed with a safety factor in mind - but I'm worried that your solid mount could lead to a potentially dangerous and/or expensive failure.

Obviously none of us have done a thorough analysis, but this is just my opinion on this. Good luck.

[OmniFocus]

I concur with others that don't believe it'll hold up.

If I were going to build one, I'd start with a flat plate on the top to cover both holes, and a flat plate at the bottom to cover both holes on the chassis leg... I'd then use a plate 90 degrees between the two... Once attached, I'd fabricate a single-plate gusset on the backside and over the top.

That part would handle the twist.. the outer single portion is to prevent side-to-side rocking and twisting of the nutserts in the chassis leg I'd use a plate and a gusset for that as well, but it could be of a more conservative metal gauge.

My design would also tend to be heavier than necessary.

[ClintB1321]

since when did VF mounts become obsolete?

[ZX3autoxtasy]

Since people found a need to shake themselves to death inside their cars.

You guys are crazy.

[Cameroon]

Originally Posted by ClintB1321

since when did VF mounts become obsolete?

Since people wanted to practice welding and engineering on non-critical parts like engine mounts.

[sporadic]

Revised with additional support.
This will be what I will be installing.
I'll let everyone know how it works out.

Thanks to those who gave constructive feedback.
If I do another version of this mount it will indeed be different than what I have here.
Ideas have to start somewhere folks, so please try and keep the sarcasim to a minimum.


Painted and drying:

[ClintB1321]

all 3 VF mounts eliminates wheel hop, and doesnt have issues of structural integrity. i know, ive been running them for over two years on my built motor, turbo duratec track focus

[sporadic]

Originally Posted by ClintB1321

all 3 VF mounts eliminates wheel hop, and doesnt have issues of structural integrity. i know, ive been running them for over two years on my built motor, turbo duratec track focus

I have absolutely nothing against the VF mounts, they're great products. I have one on the driver's side.

This is just how I work. I like to make/fix/modify things.
I fabricated my entire turbo kit from scratch.
It means nothing to me if I just throw money at products and toss them on my car.
Anyone can do that and there's nothing to be learned from it.
If I can dream it up, if I have the tools and ability then I do it.

I can probably say that most people on here are concerned with the end result when modifying a car.
Buy parts, install, drive.
No so with me. I want the entire experience of designing, engineering, and creating the parts if I can do so.
I will inevitably break things and then redesign. That's the name of the game.

Sorry for the long-winded post.

[247_racing_zx3]

Originally Posted by sporadic

This is just how I work. I like to make/fix/modify things.
I fabricated my entire turbo kit from scratch.
It means nothing to me if I just throw money at products and toss them on my car.
Anyone can do that and there's nothing to be learned from it.
If I can dream it up, if I have the tools and ability then I do it.

I think most members here are able to afford buying products that have great R&D on them. So we buy them and install them on our cars, then we are able to enjoy our cars with the new products. Instead of having to always repair things and go wrong.

[sporadic]

Originally Posted by 247_racing_zx3

I think most members here are able to afford buying products that have great R&D on them. So we buy them and install them on our cars, then we are able to enjoy our cars with the new products. Instead of having to always repair things and go wrong.

Haha. If you think I'm some broke kid that can't afford a motor mount you'd be wrong.
I could also afford the FS turbo kit, but chose to make my own... it's just me.
You enjoy the driving. I enjoy the creating and driving. Two different minds.

[OmniFocus]

Personally, I applaud your spirit.

Hope it works well for you.. if not, I hope version two does.