Focus Photos

[GrpB]

Sec 20: Any 17-inch OEM Ford SVT or Ford Racing wheel may be used.

I see OEM Ford, so as I see it only wheels that came on an SVT from the factory, which Ford Racing happens to sell (along with Ebay, junkyards, etc) are legal. So I would think that that any non-OEM wheels, including (and especially) the "Tuner" wheels in the Ford Racing catalog would be disallowed.

Perhaps someone can clarify?

Again, it doesn't matter who I am if what I say makes sense. If a "somebody" says the sun won't rise tomorrow does the argument become any less ludicrous?

And why should a Spec Focus be able to cross compete (in SCCA)? The discussion is about NASA Spec Focus, not NASA-SCCA Crossover Vehicles. Should NASA rules be tailored around building a competitive SCCA car?

If you won SCCA IT or SSC with a Spec Focus what contingencies would you claim anyway? Most likely you'd be running for fun and for tracktime anyway. So if you don't win when you run SCCA with your NASA car because the rules are a little different, so what? You could still run, a Spec Focus would still be legal for some class in both sanctioning bodies.

Your history matters more than mine because if you said you were a multi time national/regional/local front runner and you're used to winning, Spec Focus wouldn't allow you to do that, well that argument carries some weight. If you'd said you've driven a Spec Focus and run comparable lap times to other drivers, and you don't like the setup, that would carry some weight. But if you've never driven one and you've never raced before, and you're arguing that you won't be competitive in something you have no experience with, well then I agree, you can't be competitive in racing if you you don't do it.

[Knestis]

Originally Posted by GrpB

...And why should a Spec Focus be able to cross compete (in SCCA)? ...

* Entrants would have more flexibility, easing entry to SF

* Those in areas where NASA doesn't offer a packed schedule could get more use out of their car

* School options would expand, easing licensing for everyone involved

* Markets for used cars would expand

* The aftermarket would have a greater incentive to be involved

* Folks at other races would be exposed to SF cars and the concept

* Teams could spread support and rentals across a larger market, making them more viable

* ...or how about, "it would be fun?"

It doesn't always have to be a them-vs-us thing. Sometimes cooperation is ultimately a good thing for everyone involved, particularly since despite the "pro" in the NASA moniker, we mostly do this to have a good time.

K

[BUR_ZX3]

Originally Posted by GrpB

Sec 20: Any 17-inch OEM Ford SVT or Ford Racing wheel may be used.

Its so nice of whoever you are to hide behind your keyboard and not step out and stand behind your words.



But I digress. Any 17 Inch. Foci ZX3 came stock with 15", upgradable to 16". Thats not running with stock wheels. Thats mandated to use 17" wheels.

Shall I go into all the reasons that a 17" wheel is not optimal for our cars?

[Ted7rns]

Actual the 17” wheels are very optimal with the package we have. It fits in with the Toyo Tires we are using, it also fits in with the SVT Brake package, and it fits in with our Ford Racing sponsor as well. Also, 17” is a common size for all Touring cars.

We are not going to have two different size wheels to use, So we picked the common sized that our sponsor sells.

Also there was a misconception on why we didn’t go with the Luff wheels… It had nothing to do with people making a big stink over it. It all had to do with sponsorships. The projective sponsorship we had with Luff fell through, and FRPP wanted to step-in and fill that Wheel Sponsorship.

[Ted7rns]

I’m going to make a stern warning. I would like this thread to calm down. It will do us no good if it continues they way it is going. NASA and it’s sponsors have put hard work into this project and feels we’re going in the right direction. If you have a problem with the series please pm or email me directly.

I do not want to make any of our sponsors upset. We’re very pleased to have the sponsors we have and look forward to work with them in the future.

[Smurf]

.

[Ted7rns]

I would like to move on from this. There's good info on this post for people to read and understand how the series is going.

Lets just do this in a productive way.

[GrpB]

K - I 100% agree that being able to run with more than one sanctioning body is ideal, I should have put the last paragraph first; that a "Spec Focus would still be legal for some class in both sanctioning bodies". My point was that you could easily build a car that is legal for both NASA and SCCA, but it shouldn't be expected that it would be a winner with both sanctioning bodies. I don't think that because the car might be legal, but not be a winner with multiple sanctioning bodies, that it should stop someone from building the car, as long as there is at least one place where the car definitely will be competitive.

If one was primarily running Spec Focus, there's no reason not to run in IT with SCCA, the car just might not be competitive. But it would be for fun and/or tracktime anyway, so what does it matter? Or vice versa, someone might be running SSC in SCCA primarily, they could run in Spec Focus also, the car just might not be competitve. Unless the rules are identical between sanctioning bodies one car can't be ideal for both. But let's be real, this doesn't seem like a cut-throat class, it seems more like a way for people to get some wheel to wheel experience with the car they already have, without the need for a truck and trailer, corner scales, etc. and still have a genuine chance of getting a trophy at the end of the weekend.

I'm done "discussing" with the others, apparently your resume needs to be posted before you can talk about the planets orbiting the sun, and clearly some of these people have a vast amount of technical knowledge and experience (which I obviously don't have) with things like "adjustable" suspension and the inherent disadvantages of 17" wheels (where would one begin on that one?), but you had a vaild point with regard to cross-competition between sanctioning bodies that I wanted to clarify.

Good luck with your season this year! Those of you that are actually running something.

[focaljet-1]

I think GrpB's points are well articulated. I don't see any reason to shoot the messenger.

Maybe it's just me, but I don't see the inherent need to make a car cross-compatible with other series. As mentioned, it would be a real challenge to build the car to be a champion in two different series. Why not stick to one and do it well?

At the grassroots level I guess it's a bonus if you want to compete in everything that comes your way, and could help resale value. But still, those should be secondary concerns IMHO.

If it were me:

A. I'd want to build a car to the most dialed example of the formula as I could
B. If you're thinking about selling the car before you even start, maybe it's not for you?

So, I would pick the series I was most interested in and build to that spec. Plus, the Spec Focus rules are not going to destroy a car in such a way as to not make it convertible to another series by a future owner.

Just my .02

I would challenge everyone that posts to make intelligent arguments

[focaljet-1]

I would also like to add that I think the concept of Spec Focus is being lost in some of these esoteric discussions.

My take on Spec Focus is to provide a car that:

Is economical to buy and maintain
Is novice friendly yet provides room for more advanced drivers
Can be driven to the track, and even daily... if so need be

If you want to split your track time between doing "real" racing in a Spec Focus and doing "track days" where your idea of fun is to show up and embarrass guys in more expensive cars the two really don't co-exisit too well. And why should they?

Neither pursuit is wrong, I'm not saying that, just different. You have to decide which you'd rather do more. It's like having a girl that's good in the bedroom and one that that can cook like a gourmet chef. Sure it'd be great to marry both of them, but it doesn't work that way. Pick which is more important to you.

[tophe7d]

Another racers perspective...

As most of you know, I was looking at running the spec Focus series, but it was always going to play second fiddle to my original sanctioning body (Midwestern Council who follows SCCA classing). So after much personal debate and battling with possible "Cross Over" issues, I decided to run the car in IT this year and not SF. I did it because it fit the rules and type of car that I wanted to build. I wanted to build a more specialty purpose vehicle and so I am. Am I going to bash SF and Ford and Ted? No. I didn't like the rules so I went elsewhere. Canstantly bashing Ted and the car isn't going to get you anywhere. Ted is a great guy, very personable and very interested in seeing this series flourish. He has everyone's best interests in mind!

Ted, keep up the good work and good luck on the West Coast! Sorry I won't be formally running with you this year. Maybe next year Your car looks great!

Craig, man I miss running around Waterford with you (in my rearview mirror of course ) and if you remember, my old "IT" car rolled a lot more than that Spec car did. Too bad I was stuck running Torsion bars and a solid rear axle :O Good luck and hopefully I'll be back to WHRRI soon. Nice picture, got anymore?

[Ted7rns]

[/QUOTE]

holy body roll. The rear inside tire is off the ground as well.

Chris, I like you new cage... Good Job

[airforcefocus]

Makes me want to rent another Focus and take it on the track!

[slidemaster]

God Chris every time I see those pics I smile. Gotta love you spirit!

Todd -"Its so nice of whoever you are to hide behind your keyboard and not step out and stand behind your words."

Dont worry he is real. Very involved with motorsports at a very high level. Very suprised to see him here. Man he opened pandoras box

Anyhow, what I see is a launched agenda, that for once recognises the fact that we dont have ton of cash to throw at the hobbie. The funds set aside by corporate sponsors is damn impressive. I have to look at the times during the testing and at the Mid west GTG to say that this is a car that can run pretty strong with the Miata group dispite being design to be cost effective for the end user and potencially a car you car drive to work. Face it guys, Focus's are easy to drive!

This is an opinion and take for that, but NASA (at least out here) is growing fast. Dont think for a second that the corporate guys that put this together at Ford and other places didnt look at the SCCA. Its the right place to be with a car you can actually race cheep. There is some help to pay for it (Amazing) and the cars have shown decent speed.

This is about really racing, going at it! Not having the fastest tuner car or 50k Focus. There are venues for that too, just call Redlinetrack events and sign up for the time attack. I have learned, and continue to learn that message boards have a wild demograghic, and I have learned a ton here at FC as well as made contacts. Our mystery friend has fogotten more about true race car set up than I know. For what its worth his opinion is highly regarded by myself and his suggestions (when I can get them) on car set up are ALWAYS tried.

Allan

[Hal]

Another point to consider for those who talk about being competitive in different series. To me, being competitive means "going for the win" , being the class champion at the end of the season.

I don't know how it is on the west coast but here in the east, you don't stand much of a chance if you do not attend every event in the series. If there are 6 or 8 races in the series over the season, every time you miss one some other (possibly slower) car is getting the points while you get none.

If you try to run two series, you are going to run into scheduling conflicts, car problems, etc. which will ruin your chances of being "competitive" in either series.

[slidemaster]

Good point, its super hard to take 1 car and run two different organizations

[Ted7rns]

Originally Posted by Hal

Another point to consider for those who talk about being competitive in different series. To me, being competitive means "going for the win" , being the class champion at the end of the season.

I don't know how it is on the west coast but here in the east, you don't stand much of a chance if you do not attend every event in the series. If there are 6 or 8 races in the series over the season, every time you miss one some other (possibly slower) car is getting the points while you get none.

If you try to run two series, you are going to run into scheduling conflicts, car problems, etc. which will ruin your chances of being "competitive" in either series.

Very good point. It's pretty much the same out here in the West. If you attend all the races you will do VERY well. There's always going to be something to fix during the seasons, and since most of us can only work on the cars during the weekend, it could cost you a championship if you race in one region just for fun and brake something just one week before you're suppost to race in the series you want to win the championship in.

These are things we all have to weigh out. Now, that being said.... I will be running my Spec Focus in another NASA series like PT...but that is so I have a chance to do well in that series as well.... But, my main goal is to be at EVERY race weekend in NASA-SoCal (Which is something I haven't done this year, because of motor problems).

Very Good Point Hal.

[Knestis]

Originally Posted by Hal

... being competitive means "going for the win" , being the class champion at the end of the season. ...

But there are other approaches that are just as, or perhaps more, consistent with the SF mission of reasonably affordable, sensible racing. I'd like to clarify that my argument for the value of crossover options wasn't about winning multiple championships: it was about making it easier for folks to actually do SF, to find ways for it to make even more sense.

K

[slidemaster]

We understand and appreciate the point, its not a perfect world and this is a ton better than those irritating Pro7 cars. My ears are still ringing from last weekend.

[Ted7rns]

Originally Posted by slidemaster

We understand and appreciate the point, its not a perfect world and this is a ton better than those irritating Pro7 cars. My ears are still ringing from last weekend.

They do have annoying sounds…. But I’ll tell you what… back in 1995 I saw those new Mazda’s GTP cars….and the sounds of those things were awesome.

[slidemaster]

Ted met your bud Andrew on Sunday. Didnt get to talk to much, as its a semi work deal for me but he seemed real cool

[Ted7rns]

Originally Posted by slidemaster

Ted met your bud Andrew on Sunday. Didnt get to talk to much, as its a semi work deal for me but he seemed real cool

Yeah, he's pretty cool and a very good driver. He's working on my car now. He'll be putting on a new head and will be doing the tuning it.

I haven't seen him since last November.

[biscuitninja]

After all this debate, I'm just happy to see love for the '05. I want to, but unfortunately without the rear sway bar i'm sure my car would be FAR out of the running. But it should be fun to give it a run.
-bix

[Ted7rns]

Originally Posted by biscuitninja

After all this debate, I'm just happy to see love for the '05. I want to, but unfortunately without the rear sway bar i'm sure my car would be FAR out of the running. But it should be fun to give it a run.
-bix

What rear bar do you have???

[BUR_ZX3]

Originally Posted by Ted7rns

What rear bar do you have???

Stock? None.