focus diet - Focaljet

**jezwald101** · 08-01-2007, 09:53 PM

hello all--

i have saved approx. 60lb by gutting all 4 doors and removing all sound deadening from the inside of car,,i weighed most of it,, but the caulking that i wire wheeled out and a couple of pieces that removed before i thought about weighing it all,,,also you can save a few pounds by removing sound deadener in engine bay(behind hvac)and the underbody,,anyone with other ideas of weight savings...to get underweight and have to add a balast box....jesse

**recar** · 08-01-2007, 10:03 PM

Remove any unecessary wiring/modules from wire harness.

**Racer91** · 08-01-2007, 11:34 PM

Carbon fiber roof panel...

**recar** · 08-02-2007, 08:13 AM

Replace glass with Lexan.

**timo** · 08-02-2007, 12:02 PM

Wrt glass, the rulebook only says that the windshield can be replaced with lexan (1/4" thick.)

**Ted7rns** · 08-02-2007, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timo

Wrt glass, the rulebook only says that the windshield can be replaced with lexan (1/4" thick.)

There's a new Technical Bulletin about Lexan or Polycarbonate windows and windsheilds.

http://forums.focaljet.com/nasa-spec...ns-2007-a.html

**Matt Marks** · 08-02-2007, 01:30 PM

Not in favor of the new lexan rule - it drives up cost.

Who sells it? Or are people making their own?

**Ted7rns** · 08-02-2007, 01:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Marks

Not in favor of the new lexan rule - it drives up cost.

Who sells it? Or are people making their own?

We always had it for windshield, it was just left off for the side window. It's not Manditory and with 1/4" thick it's more for safety rather then weight savings.

**timo** · 08-02-2007, 03:12 PM

Is the 1/4" thickness rule in effect for the side and back glass?

I agree with Matt.

It seems like we're finding a lot of things that are apparently legal but not specified in the rule book. This is counter to Section 4 - Format which specifies
"Modifications, addition or removal of parts are not allowed, unless specified or approved in these rules. Additional modifications are not permitted...."

I understand the right/need to be able to issue technical bulletins for clarification but it seems like changes keep coming so that cars that were built before spec focus existed fit in the class. If starting completely from scratch (i.e. no 'prototypes' exist) rules such as non-windshield lexan, dashboard cutting etc seem superfluous as they add work/$$ for the competitors w/o adding to the quality of the racing as everybody would be in the same boat w/o those types of mods.

**Matt Marks** · 08-03-2007, 11:29 AM

If this is such an issue - raise the minimum weights by 50 or 100 lbs and save everyone a lot of time and $$.

Also, not sure how it works in other states, but Lexan is a big no-no for anyone who has a car that needs to stay (somewhat) street legal. This discourages new competitors who haven't made the jump to a full time dedicated car.

If it is only a safety issue, then all glass should be required to be lexan?

**Ted7rns** · 08-03-2007, 12:13 PM

Raise the minimum weights by 50 or 100 lbs is good, but we can also lower the maximum ballast weight and achieve the same thing. This is something we’re looking into.

Keep in mind if you start taking weight out of the car like windows, ribbing, dash and etc there’s a chance you can be underweight because you can only add a maximum of 150lbs ballast, but if we lower that to 100 or 75 lbs, it will be really tough to take out all this weight. So be careful how much weight you take out.

The safety issue is more a personal driver issue where some drivers don’t want to drive with glass. Plus remember California, Arizona, Utah and Texas has a lot of tracks that have a lot of sand and small pebbles that will easily break glass. I have gone trough 4 windshields myself in 3 years of racing. That does start to add up. So, for some of us Lexan is cheaper.

**brads03zx3** · 08-03-2007, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Marks

If this is such an issue - raise the minimum weights by 50 or 100 lbs and save everyone a lot of time and $$.

Also, not sure how it works in other states, but Lexan is a big no-no for anyone who has a car that needs to stay (somewhat) street legal. This discourages new competitors who haven't made the jump to a full time dedicated car.

If it is only a safety issue, then all glass should be required to be lexan?

Sounds to me like you should leave the glass in

I believe a good driver can be competitive without taking advantage of/stretching every single rule in the book.

**JB-S1** · 08-03-2007, 05:27 PM

Those of us who personally weigh in around an eighth of a ton fully support Lexan

**Matt Marks** · 08-03-2007, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ted7rns

I have gone trough 4 windshields myself in 3 years of racing. That does start to add up. So, for some of us Lexan is cheaper.

Ted - no quibbles on this - Lexan will save on windshield breakage and I fully support those that want to run Lexan windshields. However, I don't see how this is relevant to side windows or back windows - these are purely about weight reduction.

Agree that max ballast weight would be better adjusted than overall min. weights. Makes more sense to me to me than to change min. weight.

Is there a process for giving input on proposed rule changes before they are made?

**jezwald101** · 08-03-2007, 10:30 PM

all-

i was looking to use Polycarbonate windows(plexi glass) for safety reasons,not for weight savings,,i've seen safety glass break and it is not safety if it gets in your eyes,
(im sure some of you have seen it too)..ill use stock windows if everyone agrees its weight...lets decide,,,jesse

**Ted7rns** · 08-04-2007, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Marks

Ted - no quibbles on this - Lexan will save on windshield breakage and I fully support those that want to run Lexan windshields. However, I don't see how this is relevant to side windows or back windows - these are purely about weight reduction.

Agree that max ballast weight would be better adjusted than overall min. weights. Makes more sense to me to me than to change min. weight.

Is there a process for giving input on proposed rule changes before they are made?

Well side windows can break in crashes and that can be a safety issue.

Yes we have requist form. Just fill it out and send it to me. We can review it before the 2008 season.

http://specfocus.drivenasa.com/Request.htm

It's best to copy and past then email it to me.
tseverns@drivenasa.com

**Matt Marks** · 08-13-2007, 06:47 PM

Put my car on the scales over the weekend. - 2697 with 1/4 of gas - not bad for a 2.3 ZX4 sedan. Oops - forgot to add 200 pounds for myself!

Other than the AC and HVAC (which will be the last two things to go - might as well be comfortable on the grid until the car's a competitive weight), I'm going to be hurting to drop 100 pounds much less 250. Lexan may, unfortunately, be required.

**Ted7rns** · 08-13-2007, 06:58 PM

Yeah, if you leave in the AC and HVAC in the car it's going to be hard to get down to 2,625lbs with driver in a sedan.

**Matt Marks** · 08-16-2007, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ted7rns

Yeah, if you leave in the AC and HVAC in the car it's going to be hard to get down to 2,625lbs with driver in a sedan.

Guess I need to post whore to get my 100 posts in - then I can sell the A/C stuff.

**Ted7rns** · 08-16-2007, 12:04 PM

Well you can post to agree with me on 42 more posts and you'll be there..

**jezwald101** · 09-25-2007, 10:12 PM

wiring: i have been working on the wiring for the car and its amazing how much weight you can take out of a car by removing the wiring that the car doesnt need anymore due to race prepared state,,you can remove all the radio and speaker,airbags and sensors,door locks,window wiring,seat belt,rear defroster,park brake light,,its allot of weight,ill update when i get completed and weigh all removed wiring....thanks jesse

**InFocusTraSTi** · 10-19-2007, 11:24 AM

Any updates on this? Are there any rules against removing stuff beside upper console and glass? On the side windows out of plexy or lexan being safer it is not totally true. Side windows and rear window you want to break in case you flip you will have somewhere to escape the car specially if doors get jam which is a great possibility in a flip. I know this first hand (flipped a grand am) but the front you want to stay together in case something flies and hit the windshield. Personally even if I could do lexan on the sides I wouldn't... Much safer just to remove it... but then rain races would be really bad...

**sleeperlove** · 10-19-2007, 11:35 AM

Rain doesnt get in the car when its moving. You are not allowecd to have the front windows up anyway, no matter what they are made of so you might as well remove them.

**Ted7rns** · 10-19-2007, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by InFocusTraSTi

Any updates on this? Are there any rules against removing stuff beside upper console and glass? On the side windows out of plexy or lexan being safer it is not totally true. Side windows and rear window you want to break in case you flip you will have somewhere to escape the car specially if doors get jam which is a great possibility in a flip. I know this first hand (flipped a grand am) but the front you want to stay together in case something flies and hit the windshield. Personally even if I could do lexan on the sides I wouldn't... Much safer just to remove it... but then rain races would be really bad...

We're talking more about the rear side windows. The front passenger and driver side window must be open. The rules for 2008 will be out in November.

**InFocusTraSTi** · 10-19-2007, 01:10 PM

Is there a rule against removing it? Though it was the front windows...

08-01-2007, 09:53 PM	#1
jezwald101 TEAM Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Westland,MI Posts: 166	focus diet hello all-- i have saved approx. 60lb by gutting all 4 doors and removing all sound deadening from the inside of car,,i weighed most of it,, but the caulking that i wire wheeled out and a couple of pieces that removed before i thought about weighing it all,,,also you can save a few pounds by removing sound deadener in engine bay(behind hvac)and the underbody,,anyone with other ideas of weight savings...to get underweight and have to add a balast box....jesse

08-01-2007, 10:03 PM	#2
recar Senior TEAM Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New York Posts: 1,475	Re: focus diet Remove any unecessary wiring/modules from wire harness.

08-01-2007, 11:34 PM	#3
Racer91 Rookie Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 7	Re: focus diet Carbon fiber roof panel...

08-02-2007, 08:13 AM	#4
recar Senior TEAM Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New York Posts: 1,475	Re: focus diet Replace glass with Lexan.

08-02-2007, 12:02 PM	#5
timo Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Brighton, MI Posts: 62	Re: focus diet Wrt glass, the rulebook only says that the windshield can be replaced with lexan (1/4" thick.)

08-02-2007, 01:30 PM	#7
Matt Marks TEAM Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 237	Re: focus diet Not in favor of the new lexan rule - it drives up cost. Who sells it? Or are people making their own? __________________ 2007 NASA Mid-Atlantic Spec Focus Champion (Undefeated in a class of 1) 2007 Spec Focus National Championship - 4th place 2006 NASA Mid-Atlantic 944 Supercup - Champion

08-02-2007, 03:12 PM	#9
timo Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Brighton, MI Posts: 62	Re: focus diet Is the 1/4" thickness rule in effect for the side and back glass? I agree with Matt. It seems like we're finding a lot of things that are apparently legal but not specified in the rule book. This is counter to Section 4 - Format which specifies "Modifications, addition or removal of parts are not allowed, unless specified or approved in these rules. Additional modifications are not permitted...." I understand the right/need to be able to issue technical bulletins for clarification but it seems like changes keep coming so that cars that were built before spec focus existed fit in the class. If starting completely from scratch (i.e. no 'prototypes' exist) rules such as non-windshield lexan, dashboard cutting etc seem superfluous as they add work/$$ for the competitors w/o adding to the quality of the racing as everybody would be in the same boat w/o those types of mods.

08-03-2007, 11:29 AM	#10
Matt Marks TEAM Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 237	Re: focus diet If this is such an issue - raise the minimum weights by 50 or 100 lbs and save everyone a lot of time and $$. Also, not sure how it works in other states, but Lexan is a big no-no for anyone who has a car that needs to stay (somewhat) street legal. This discourages new competitors who haven't made the jump to a full time dedicated car. If it is only a safety issue, then all glass should be required to be lexan? __________________ 2007 NASA Mid-Atlantic Spec Focus Champion (Undefeated in a class of 1) 2007 Spec Focus National Championship - 4th place 2006 NASA Mid-Atlantic 944 Supercup - Champion

08-03-2007, 12:13 PM	#11
Ted7rns Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Thousand Oaks, California Posts: 4,202	Re: focus diet Raise the minimum weights by 50 or 100 lbs is good, but we can also lower the maximum ballast weight and achieve the same thing. This is something we’re looking into. Keep in mind if you start taking weight out of the car like windows, ribbing, dash and etc there’s a chance you can be underweight because you can only add a maximum of 150lbs ballast, but if we lower that to 100 or 75 lbs, it will be really tough to take out all this weight. So be careful how much weight you take out. The safety issue is more a personal driver issue where some drivers don’t want to drive with glass. Plus remember California, Arizona, Utah and Texas has a lot of tracks that have a lot of sand and small pebbles that will easily break glass. I have gone trough 4 windshields myself in 3 years of racing. That does start to add up. So, for some of us Lexan is cheaper. __________________ NASA Spec Focus Series Director \| NASA HPDE Instructor 2002 Ford Focus ZX3 Malibu Blue <23> NASA is dedicated to aspiring or accomplished Focus racers and track enthusiast.

08-03-2007, 05:27 PM	#13
JB-S1 Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Powell, OH Posts: 88	Re: focus diet Those of us who personally weigh in around an eighth of a ton fully support Lexan __________________ Green Baron Motorsports #187 PTE Neon

08-03-2007, 10:30 PM	#15
jezwald101 TEAM Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Westland,MI Posts: 166	Re: focus diet all- i was looking to use Polycarbonate windows(plexi glass) for safety reasons,not for weight savings,,i've seen safety glass break and it is not safety if it gets in your eyes, (im sure some of you have seen it too)..ill use stock windows if everyone agrees its weight...lets decide,,,jesse

08-13-2007, 06:47 PM	#17
Matt Marks TEAM Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 237	Re: focus diet Put my car on the scales over the weekend. - 2697 with 1/4 of gas - not bad for a 2.3 ZX4 sedan. Oops - forgot to add 200 pounds for myself! Other than the AC and HVAC (which will be the last two things to go - might as well be comfortable on the grid until the car's a competitive weight), I'm going to be hurting to drop 100 pounds much less 250. Lexan may, unfortunately, be required. __________________ 2007 NASA Mid-Atlantic Spec Focus Champion (Undefeated in a class of 1) 2007 Spec Focus National Championship - 4th place 2006 NASA Mid-Atlantic 944 Supercup - Champion

08-13-2007, 06:58 PM	#18
Ted7rns Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Thousand Oaks, California Posts: 4,202	Re: focus diet Yeah, if you leave in the AC and HVAC in the car it's going to be hard to get down to 2,625lbs with driver in a sedan. __________________ NASA Spec Focus Series Director \| NASA HPDE Instructor 2002 Ford Focus ZX3 Malibu Blue <23> NASA is dedicated to aspiring or accomplished Focus racers and track enthusiast.

08-16-2007, 12:04 PM	#20
Ted7rns Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Thousand Oaks, California Posts: 4,202	Re: focus diet Well you can post to agree with me on 42 more posts and you'll be there.. __________________ NASA Spec Focus Series Director \| NASA HPDE Instructor 2002 Ford Focus ZX3 Malibu Blue <23> NASA is dedicated to aspiring or accomplished Focus racers and track enthusiast.

09-25-2007, 10:12 PM	#21
jezwald101 TEAM Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Westland,MI Posts: 166	Re: focus diet wiring: i have been working on the wiring for the car and its amazing how much weight you can take out of a car by removing the wiring that the car doesnt need anymore due to race prepared state,,you can remove all the radio and speaker,airbags and sensors,door locks,window wiring,seat belt,rear defroster,park brake light,,its allot of weight,ill update when i get completed and weigh all removed wiring....thanks jesse

10-19-2007, 11:24 AM	#22
InFocusTraSTi TEAM Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 195	Re: focus diet Any updates on this? Are there any rules against removing stuff beside upper console and glass? On the side windows out of plexy or lexan being safer it is not totally true. Side windows and rear window you want to break in case you flip you will have somewhere to escape the car specially if doors get jam which is a great possibility in a flip. I know this first hand (flipped a grand am) but the front you want to stay together in case something flies and hit the windshield. Personally even if I could do lexan on the sides I wouldn't... Much safer just to remove it... but then rain races would be really bad...

10-19-2007, 11:35 AM	#23
sleeperlove You wouldn't like me when I'm angry. Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in the dirt Posts: 8,494	Re: focus diet Rain doesnt get in the car when its moving. You are not allowecd to have the front windows up anyway, no matter what they are made of so you might as well remove them. __________________ I'm in ur posts changin ur werdz.

10-19-2007, 01:10 PM	#25
InFocusTraSTi TEAM Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 195	Re: focus diet Is there a rule against removing it? Though it was the front windows...

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