SVTF to H Stock?

[autotec]

Some time back, there was some info about the SVTF going to H Stock. Has there been anymore info about this? Just trying to get a game plan going for next year. Any info would be great.

[OmniFocus]

All I know is that it was moving for 2010.

[autotec]

Originally Posted by OmniFocus

All I know is that it was moving for 2010.

Thanks for the reply.

[chrisp78]

confirmed, "effective 1/1/10 the SVT Focus moves from G-stock to H-stock".

[Ataru]

If the SVTF goes to H-stock, does that mean it would now be a FSP car as well and not a DSP car?

[Auto-X-ZTS]

Originally Posted by Ataru

If the SVTF goes to H-stock, does that mean it would now be a FSP car as well and not a DSP car?

Not necessarily. Stock classes do not automatically preclude what SP class a car goes into...good example: EF Civic... HS--->ST--->CSP.

That said, the SVTF *should* be an FSP car IMO. All things being the same, I think I'd rather have the 'big block' Mueller 2.3 Focus in FSP than the SVT though.

[Ataru]

True, but when you already own an SVT, it's kinda hard to change that.

It seems silly that an EF Civic goes from ST to CSP when a Focus goes from ST to either FSP or DSP. That right there shows that the EF Civic has too much of an advantage in ST simply by what class it would move up to.

Sounds like there needs to me more ST classes.

[TennTechMan]

Anyone else considering prep'ing their SVTF for H-stock? Assuming it goes through. I think I'll probably give it a shot.

[patinum]

I would be interested in seeing what would be involved into getting a SVTF to be at least regionally competitive.

[pkolator]

Originally Posted by patinum

I would be interested in seeing what would be involved into getting a SVTF to be at least regionally competitive.

It depends on how competitive your region is. But some A6s, lightweight wheels and double adjustable Konis should do the trick. Maybe a larger front sway.

[Auto-X-ZTS]

Hey Omni--how are you liking all EG Civics on the same line in FSP? That means a CX or VX with the VTEC Si drivetrain is in FSP now...

[patinum]

Originally Posted by pkolator

It depends on how competitive your region is. But some A6s, lightweight wheels and double adjustable Konis should do the trick. Maybe a larger front sway.

Actually, I'm in your region I stick to the smaller clubs though for the seat time to price ratio (Windy City Miata Club, Salt Creek, INR-SCCA, Audi CCCC, Chicago VW). Think I did 2 Chicago region events earlier this year in my S2000.

[OmniFocus]

Originally Posted by Auto-X-ZTS

Hey Omni--how are you liking all EG Civics on the same line in FSP? That means a CX or VX with the VTEC Si drivetrain is in FSP now...

We'll see. As I'd not expected two years ago, it isn't the engine that is making the Civics brutally fast... It is the low CoG and SLA suspension. Those guys have all sorts of ideal contact patch... all the time.

About the time we started running the Focus in FSP, there was a movement to really shake up the class. There are a lot of ways to be competitive... including the AE86's return to FSP.

After this year, I've come to the conclusion that either A) I can't drive, or B) We need to do something drastically different.

We're really changing the game plan for next year, that much is certain.

[pkolator]

Originally Posted by patinum

Actually, I'm in your region I stick to the smaller clubs though for the seat time to price ratio (Windy City Miata Club, Salt Creek, INR-SCCA, Audi CCCC, Chicago VW). Think I did 2 Chicago region events earlier this year in my S2000.

I've never run with any of those clubs, but I have run at Maywood...and that lot is HORRIBLE.

Tri-State Sports Car Council (a smaller independent club) is an awesome club! I think we averaged 8-10 runs per event, in nice lots, with awesome courses and REALLY good drivers (national trophy and class winners).

And unless they get a different car, H stock will continue to be dominated by Aaron and Wes. Both regional top 20 drivers. But don't be discouraged, competition makes you a better driver

[SVTBuckeye]

Fast Track, the latest one, said that the change to H Stock was recommended to the BOD. That usually is a positive vote. I never can figure when something is actually passed???

[TennTechMan]

I'm not buying my A6's until I see it in the rule book. If it shows up there, I will likely be taking a stab at H-stock.

[JimmySolo2]

Originally Posted by OmniFocus

After this year, I've come to the conclusion that either A) I can't drive, or B) We need to do something drastically different.

We're really changing the game plan for next year, that much is certain.

Sorry but that reminded me of the movie Dodge Ball.

Cotton McKnight: I'm being told that Average Joe's does not have enough players and will be forfeiting the championship match.
Pepper Brooks: It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it pays off for 'em.

[wrc_fan]

Originally Posted by OmniFocus

After this year, I've come to the conclusion that either A) I can't drive, or B) We need to do something drastically different.

We're really changing the game plan for next year, that much is certain.

Even more off topic, Omni, what do you have in mind for changes? I would like to incorporate (steal) any changes you make into my own build

Seriously though, with my own build I've followed on some things that you've posted in the past. Sorry if you've mentioned it before, but are you running any data aquisition during competition?

[OmniFocus]

Well, I've discovered that all this talk about a sway bar on the drive wheels being a bad idea actually has some merit. With any sort of bar dialed in, those fat Hoosiers make enough grip to unload the front, and spin all the power away. With the bar disconnected, the body roll is severe enough that we're driving on the outside half of the tire, sacrificing all sorts of grip.

...so we're going two ways. First, the front spring rate is going up to 800 lb/in from the current 550 lb/in. I want to go drastic. Springs are cheap, so if we need to go up or down from there, it isn't a big expense.

Second, we need more camber. I'll be working with the top of the struts to make that happen. It'll probably raise the car a little (1/4" or so)... which is probably good, because with the angle of the control arm, the camber loss with any roll is terrible.

Third, either the car has developed beyond what the Torsen can handle, or the Torsen isn't working any more. Even on a fresh slurry-sealed surface, it'll light up the inside front with the bar on full soft. We're going to try a Kaaz clutch-type LSD instead. While the box is out, a fresh clutch will be going in.

As for rear spring rates, I'm not going to worry about it. That can be dialed in once the front works.

The BEST thing this year was that I took the time to try all sorts of settings, quite often between runs so that the difference was immediately noticeable.

To make this car work in FSP, you have to play to the single advantage it has (horsepower) without sacrificing cornering grip. With FWD, that is proving to be a challenge.

[brads03zx3]

Lorin, where are you sourcing a Kaaz unit?

[wrc_fan]

^Yes, please disclose this info, I'm already planning to pull the trans from my car this winter to install a new clutch, flywheel, and LSD.

[Auto-X-ZTS]

Originally Posted by OmniFocus

Well, I've discovered that all this talk about a sway bar on the drive wheels being a bad idea actually has some merit. With any sort of bar dialed in, those fat Hoosiers make enough grip to unload the front, and spin all the power away. With the bar disconnected, the body roll is severe enough that we're driving on the outside half of the tire, sacrificing all sorts of grip.

...so we're going two ways. First, the front spring rate is going up to 800 lb/in from the current 550 lb/in. I want to go drastic. Springs are cheap, so if we need to go up or down from there, it isn't a big expense.

Second, we need more camber. I'll be working with the top of the struts to make that happen. It'll probably raise the car a little (1/4" or so)... which is probably good, because with the angle of the control arm, the camber loss with any roll is terrible.

Third, either the car has developed beyond what the Torsen can handle, or the Torsen isn't working any more. Even on a fresh slurry-sealed surface, it'll light up the inside front with the bar on full soft. We're going to try a Kaaz clutch-type LSD instead. While the box is out, a fresh clutch will be going in.

As for rear spring rates, I'm not going to worry about it. That can be dialed in once the front works.

The BEST thing this year was that I took the time to try all sorts of settings, quite often between runs so that the difference was immediately noticeable.

To make this car work in FSP, you have to play to the single advantage it has (horsepower) without sacrificing cornering grip. With FWD, that is proving to be a challenge.

Are you going to be FSB-less; we can make up a tiny bar too if that is food for thought.

That is what we did on the ZX2--went -1/16" (1" to 15/16") on FSB, increased castor and upped springs 100 pounds (550 to 650). By increasing castor (2+ to almost 5), and slightly reducing the neg camber (went from about -3 to -2.25 static)...be get a flatter tire for getting power down, but the caster is like 'dynamic' negative camber. Seems to work better--we just dont have enough shock at the moment.

[OmniFocus]

As for sourcing the Kaaz, we're looking into that. There appears to be a few sources... there are also more than one type these days.

Erik: I was thinking about contacting you for one. A tiny one would be nice for tweaks.

[brads03zx3]

Tiny bars still act as droop limiters...just sayin'

[Auto-X-ZTS]

Originally Posted by OmniFocus

Erik: I was thinking about contacting you for one. A tiny one would be nice for tweaks.

Lemme know.