This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?
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  1. #1
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    Angry This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    Cliff's notes:

    I took my car in for grinding sound from brakes, because its under warranty and I know there's a lot of pad left.

    1. Car was in the dealer service dept for brake related noise.

    2. Although the problem was duplicated in the initial test drive, the technician could not duplicate it. They felt the lug nuts weren't tight enough, so they tightened them down. Well, the problem was clearly there afterward. Maybe the tech is deaf in this sound spectrum.

    3. Service advisor offered to let me have a visual inspection.

    4. When they tried to undo the wheel lock they over tightened themselves, they let their impact wrench slip messing up on wheel in addition to not being able to take off the wheel lock.

    5. Service advisor reported to me that the wheel damage is not their problem and suggest I go after the shop who worked on the wheel before they over tightened for damage and Beaverton Ford would not pay for damage. This is from the same service advisor who had told me "we had retorqued your lug nuts"

    6. Eventually they agreed to pay and I'm still waiting to see what will happen. Service advisor claimed "it was a misunderstanding".

    7. Service advisor/manager both refused to replace the wheel. Svc. manager tells me he will replace it if the repair is not satisfactory.

    8. Wheel repaired. Absolutely medicore repair quality. Why did they even bother? They must have had used this shop in the past.

    9. Eventually got a new wheel.

    10. Many hours wasted arguing, sitting at Les Schwab to fix up their mistake, etc.

    Details:
    My '05 Focus has had random squeals from the front brakes while not being applied at random, but it was progressing to grinding, so on Aug 23, 2006, I decided to take it to the service dept to my usual service dealer
    Beaverton Ford

    12325 SW Canyon Rd
    Beaverton Oregon.

    For those of you familiar with the area, it's the Ford dealer on north side of Canyon Rd between Cedar Hills Blvd and Beaverton Fred Meyer.


    I had my new tires from Tirerack.com put on my wheels by the fine people at A-N-T Tire&Wheel in Portland at 8131 N Interstate Ave not long ago and I personally saw the tech installing the wheels on my car using a torque wrench, so I know that all my wheels are torqued the same. The grinding/squealing was there with the old stock steel wheels and it just happens that I haven't bothered to take the car in until this week.

    I got to the dealership early in the morning and I went for a short test drive with the service advisor , which reproduced the problem on the spot. Dropped off the car and went on with my day.

    I was supposed to be informed with the details of the problem, but I have not heard them after five hours have passed, so I gave my service advisor a call. I was told "we could not reproduce the problem further, however we re-torqued the right rear and/or right front"(he was unsure exactly which)(*1) and to come pick up my car. At that point I took what I was told for face value.

    When I went to pick it up, my service advisor assured me both inner and outer brake pads have plenty lining left and neither had unusual wear pattern nor anything unusual stuck in it(*2)

    He offered to take me back to the shop and let me visually inspect the brake components. He had me wait in the waiting room and said I will be called into the shop once they get my car up on the lift. After waiting for about 15 minutes, he has yet to get me, so I checked through the window and see that my car's already up on the lift. I go around the back and see three employees standing around it, one of them my service advisor, one of the other two, whom I later found out is the service manager.

    So, I go to my car and this is what I see:


    With the service manager, my service advisor, and the other employee present, one of them said "your lug nuts are way over-torqued. We could not get your wheel lock off who worked on your wheels before you brought it here?"

    I told them it was installed by an independent shop and I was there when the tech installed all the nuts with a torque wrench. So, he immediately tells me " they don't know how to use their torque wrench, because they're way overtightened. we tried to remove it with a handtool, but we couldn't so we used an impact wrench, but the key stripped out and jumped". They also went on about how one of their techs couldn't find my wheel lock key(which was in the cup holder). Umm... they have my phone number, ever thought about calling me and asking me the simple question "do you have the wheel lock key with the vehicle?" [confused]

    me: "who's paying for the wheel damage?"

    them: "you need to take it back to that tire shop and blame them, cuz our tools slipped due to the wheel lock being on too tight"

    In fact, it is them that over tightened the lug nuts + wheel lock. As stated by the service advisor(see *1 above), they re-torqued the wheel. Also, the findings he reported in (see *2) implies they had the wheel in order to be able to make those observations.

    Despite the fact my service manager KNEW that they're the last one who worked on it, he just stood there in the conversation and let the "blame the other tire shop" game continue. [mad] What the hell?!

    So, this is what the wheel lock they over-torqued, then subsequently tried to remove looks like: (except the hexagonal pattern on the outside, which is from the skilled technicians at Les Schwab who had to forcefully remove this thing the dealership over-torqued and stripped out the key groove)


    As I said before, all 16 lug nuts were tightened by the same torque wrench by the same guy at A-N-T before being brought to this dealership in my presence. I had Les Schwab remove all four wheel locks since with one of them destroyed, the set is mismatched and now useless. After they removed them, all looked fine except the one dealership service dept got stuck on right front.


    (When these pictures were taken, the nuts have already been removed from the wheels, but I hand-tightened them back on for the camera.)

    When I asked for this whole B.S. to be put in writing, the service advisor said "we'll document everything for you, so you can go after the other tire shop for tightening the bolts so much and causing us to screw up your wheel, now if you would go wait in the waiting room". He knew the dealership was the last one to work on it and tells they're not paying for it and had the nerve to tell me to go blame the innocent shop for the dealership's negligence.

    Heck, even if something was tightened way beyond normal torque when they receive the car, that's when they should stop, call and ask. What kind of shop keeps forcing it, then tell you "well it was too tight and we ***** it up, go blame the guy who worked on it before us".

    After another 15 minutes went by, service advisor came by and said "after I talked to my boss, since we are re-torqued it, we'll fix it".

    I didn't know that one of the other two employees is the service manager. I had only found this out after he called me back following a letter I sent them and told me "one of the two employees standing there" was him. Well why the heck didn't he tell me that right there in shop, discuss the details in the back while having me wait in the waiting room? The service advisor simply said "I just talked to my boss" not even telling me one of the other guys was the boss.

    In my conversation with the service manager, he admitted they tightened the lug nuts, but says they didn't torque the wheel lock. (So, this implies they tightened down three out of four lug nuts. ). But then,the findings my svc advisor repoted me in (*2) points back to the dealership as being the last party to tighten all the lug nuts on the wheel in question.

    He complained about the call being recorded after he noticed the beeps(the recording notice tone the recorder makes for the states that requires this by law) and how he should have been told about it. When I advised of my right to record as one of the parties in phone conversation in the state of Oregon under "one party consent" law he then compained about "there's a difference between your rights and being a decent individual". WELL.. if they were being decent individuals and not making me concerned that they may change story later, I woudn't have felt I needed to secure evidence.

    ---
    They issue is still being worked on. Even though they eventually budged and agreed to pay, it wasn't upfront and honest. It was more of the "we can't BS our way out, unfortuantely we have to pay" sorta attitude.[?|]

    Ok, so the car was originally taken in on Wednesday. They said they will be sending my wheel to their contract wheel repair shop and I will be given a rental during the repair. Instead of taking my car and giving me a rental right on the spot, they tell me to bring the car back in on Monday and give them about three days for repair. Why should I wait until Monday before they even start on it? I am thinking they're avoiding having to have the rental out through the weekend. After the BS they tried to put me through, I am fairly certain my convenience is not their priority.

    Update: Aug 28:
    ---------------------
    I took the car in with one of my steel wheels, so they can put it on while the alloy wheel is being repaired.

    Service manager refused to replace the wheel until the repair is complete and both he and I deem it unsatisfactory, whatever his standards are.

    I also got them to pay for a new set of wheel locks.

    As soon as I got home, I immediately took my "+" shaped tire iron to the lug nuts. Just as I expected, they were torqued through the ceiling. One of them would not come off by hands. I had to stand on one leg, then pull on the other before the lug nut squealed loudly and loosened. Now, that is NOT 95 lbs-ft specified by Ford. They really don't know what the hell they're doing and they're not touching my car again, evar!

    Update Sept 5th
    I got a call from my service advisor Joe T that my wheel is repaired. Upon arrival, I did a quick visual check. It looked ok at this point, so I ok'ed them to put on my tire. A technician JD attempts to put on the wheel on the tire at the tire machine, but he struggled along with two other techs standing around. It made me cringe for the well being of my tire beads. They had to take it to their other shop across the street and have another tech install it on a different machine. After this was done, JD carries my wheel back to the first shop by rolling it across the street with my wheel mounted. This is ok for a bare tire, but is this how you expect a repair shop to treat your wheel/tire? If it knocks over, there goes your finish.

    The dealership's outsource shop removed the damage from metal alright, but upon closer look after everything was installed, I noticed all sides of spokes didn't have the same gloss and when I touched it, it felt like a sandpaper. In frustration, I said it was "good enough" for the time being. This was seriously becoming a waste of my time. When I told the svc advisor that this is getting to be a waste of my time, he arrogantly tells me it's a waste of his time too. Well don't **** up my car in the first place. Can't believe he told me its a waste of his time fixing something his technician is responsible for. I told him it wasn't acceptable and I expect a new one and exchanged a few words. He asked me to leave for using the word "****". In the end, he said "when you let other people work on things happen, that's just life"- svc. adv. the Beaverton Ford way of treating customers.

    So want to talk about using words "other people might not want to hear"? I heard the women in service dept desk using four letter words that was clearly audible while I waited in the waiting room. Code of conduct: cursing by desk clerks is ok day to day. Not ok for customers who's just had his car f'ed up.

    When I got home I found they cut more corners on this wheel repair. I could actually dig into the clearcoat with my fingernail. Later in the day, I washed my car and pressure water meets poorly repaired wheel and the new coating ripped right off. This is NOT like the quality of original finish on factory wheel.




    Update Sept 6th
    Called service manager. Explained the problem with the quality of repair. We've previously agreed to replace with a new wheel if he can verify the quality is not to my liking within a reason. So I asked to schedule a time for him to inspect the result with me. he didn't question it and ordered a new one from the service dept. He was civil and respectful in this conversation.

    Update Sept 8th 06:
    The replacement wheel was in stock at the warehouse and I got it sooner than expected. Service manager paid for the cost to have it mounted/balanced at Les Schwab.

    I found the service manager became more agreeable near the end, however the service advisor Joe T remained a jack ass the entire time.

    Anyways, Wheel is back to pre-loss conditions.

    The original grinding noise is not fixed.

    Three trips to Les Schwab had to be made due to dealership negligence.

    1. To get the wheel lock the old fart (who didn't even think of looking in the cup holder for the key or calling me to ask where the key is) stripped out and got stuck on my car doing something stupid. Had to leave this task for the professional. I question the ability of this old fart to be able to do it.

    2. To get a new set of wheel lock that aforementioned idiot destroyed.

    3. To get the half-ass repaired wheel swapped out with a new one.

    2-3 gallons of gas.

    Many hours of my time.

    Small damage happens in service and I really don't have issues with that. It was THEIR FAULT and they should have accepted without attempting to bullcrap their way out by trying to convince me to shift the responsibility of a damage they caused to a different shop, then put me in the position to have to argue just to get something they should have offered on their side.

    In my experience, I have received good service from Beaverton Ford until I was given Joe T. as my service advisor and had to deal with his own and his technician's rudeness, lack of accountability and pure B.S. He does not want me back and I don't want to go back, therefore I'm not going back.

    I would suggest if any of you have no choice, but to take your vehicle to Beaverton Ford, PHOTOGRAPH EVERYTHING. If they damage your car and a "your word against ours" situation arises, you have a good evidence.
    Last edited by Soviet Russia; Sep 10, 2006 at 4:40 AM.

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  3. #2
    [FJ] Addict GapBoyPCS's Avatar
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    You got one hit against your story: You don't know the torque spec that independent shop used.

    Also, did you give them your locking nut key or did the dealership rummage through and attempt to find a master one?
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  4. #3
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    The dealer should have known not to use an impact on a locking wheel lug nut....It sounds to me like some tech was in a hurry. I think the shop should have called him if they had any problems.
    - Zach

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  6. #4
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    You only use an impact gun on the outside "spline type",not the "inside type"
    which is on your car.Really,you shouldn't even use an impact gun on any type of
    wheel lock,but you can get away with it only a few times before they start to strip right out.That tech has no common sense or is learning the hard way.

  7. #5
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    Quote Originally Posted by GapBoyPCS
    You got one hit against your story: You don't know the torque spec that independent shop used.
    What I asked was around 80 ft-lbs,but its irrelevant. It only became stuck after the dealership TORQUED it, then tried to remove it subsequently.

    Also, did you give them your locking nut key or did the dealership rummage through and attempt to find a master one?
    I didn't hand it to them, but it was where anyone with a grain of common sense would find. In the driver's side cup holder. If for some reason they don't spot it, there's no excuse they can't call me and ask.

    If you didn't hand your key to a contractor who's going to be working on your house in your absence, do you except to find your lock cylinder drilled out?

  8. #6
    Senior TEAM Member Jlongoria9's Avatar
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    Id Say Screw The Stealership!

  9. #7
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    i have heard horror stories of les schwab over tigtening and breaking lugs and wheel studs

  10. #8
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    Good for you (not that they ****ed up) for stickin' it to 'em!

  11. #9
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    IMO they are responsible for the damage.

    If they don't want to take responsibility file a claim in small claims court. Seems to me like an easy win for you.

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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    w00t w00t beaverton auto mall
    lol i baught my car from them and i had a great experiance
    however i went and got my oil changed there and they striped out the drain bolt WTF

    they payed for it though so im happy!!
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    Not Special Enough TXFO's Avatar
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    you have a sticking caliper
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  14. #12
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    Quote Originally Posted by Focusfre4k
    w00t w00t beaverton auto mall
    lol i baught my car from them and i had a great experiance
    however i went and got my oil changed there and they striped out the drain bolt WTF

    they payed for it though so im happy!!
    What did they do to strip the drain plug,use an impact gun to tighten it?LOL
    Did they just Heli-Coil it or replace the oil pan?If it was my car,I'd demand a new
    oil pan.Then again,it might be the jerks that worked on it before.That's one of the reasons I'll never let anyone do my oil changes.

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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    Quote Originally Posted by Focusfre4k
    w00t w00t beaverton auto mall
    lol i baught my car from them and i had a great experiance
    however i went and got my oil changed there and they striped out the drain bolt WTF

    they payed for it though so im happy!!
    Beaverton Ford between Cedar Hills Blvd and Fred Meyer?
    Let us know what you find out. I requested for a new wheel since my wheels are almost new.

    My service advisor boldly stated to me "no, we're not replacing your wheel. We're getting it repaired by a shop we always use", apparently to pinch a few pennies.

    I would not be surprised if they heli-coiled your oil-pan.

    I do not know how you could strip out the oil pan thread unless you're mechanically retarded, perhaps on a 1985 Tempo that's seen dozens of oil changes, but not your 2005 Focus that's only seen two or three oil changes!

    Hand tighten until it seats, then torque down with a hand tool. The thread's already well lubricated.

    Really the only way you can do it is if tighten it like half a turn, then forcefully cross thread it using an impact wrench. After what you've told me, I think I'll stop going to Beaverton Ford service dept entirely.

    If this was your first oil change, they might have just fixed it lacking anyone else to shift the blame to.

  16. #14
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    Quote Originally Posted by Soviet Russia
    Beaverton Ford between Cedar Hills Blvd and Fred Meyer?
    Let us know what you find out. I requested for a new wheel since my wheels are almost new.

    My service advisor boldly stated to me "no, we're not replacing your wheel. We're getting it repaired by a shop we always use", apparently to pinch a few pennies.

    I would not be surprised if they heli-coiled your oil-pan.

    I do not know how you could strip out the oil pan thread unless you're mechanically retarded, perhaps on a 1985 Tempo that's seen dozens of oil changes, but not your 2005 Focus that's only seen two or three oil changes!

    Hand tighten until it seats, then torque down with a hand tool. The thread's already well lubricated.

    Really the only way you can do it is if tighten it like half a turn, then forcefully cross thread it using an impact wrench. After what you've told me, I think I'll stop going to Beaverton Ford service dept entirely.

    If this was your first oil change, they might have just fixed it lacking anyone else to shift the blame to.

    i have no idea how they did it. idiots and i now do my oil my self cause of those bas tards

    i told them to give me a new pan and they declined to do that and then i had my dad come in and talk to them cause yea who would take the time to hear what i have so say(18 year old)(the stereotype punk)


    but in the end they did replace the oil pan and plug. have never ever set foot there again

    i just bash on them cause mulitple people have had tech related problems like yours!
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  17. #15
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    Default Re: This is how the Dealership Service Dept tried to mess with me. got any story too?

    Quote Originally Posted by Focusfre4k
    i have no idea how they did it. idiots and i now do my oil my self cause of those bas tards

    i told them to give me a new pan and they declined to do that and then i had my dad come in and talk to them cause yea who would take the time to hear what i have so say(18 year old)(the stereotype punk)


    but in the end they did replace the oil pan and plug. have never ever set foot there again

    i just bash on them cause mulitple people have had tech related problems like yours!
    Who's your service advisor? Mine's Joe.


 
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