Oil Change?

[TigreTek]

I live in south florida, anyone know where I can find 5W20, all I've found is 5W30. Local oil change place said they'd drop 10W30 in there, I'm trying to avoid that, so what should I do?

[Terry's S2]

Check at your local Wal Mart. The one by my house just started carrying it because several people have asked about it.

It is a synthetic blend and is about $ 1.75 a quart here.

Terry

[LastRites]

on Synthetic Blends!

[focusride]

hey the dealer where i bought my ZX3 said that i can't use Synthetic oil because it's a new car and if i do use it that will void my warrenty true or false?? i'm at 10,023 and my second oil change is going to be at 10,140 and two more month and it will be one year with my car. OHH and do you guys get your cars oil changed ever 5,000?

[spankenstein]

FALSE! Dealers can't void your warranty unless they can prove that what you did caused tha failure. I personally use Mobil1 5w30. It a "true" synthetic. You should do a search on oil reccomendadtions but I would definitely switch to a real synthetic now. I did on my third oil change and have had no problems.

[projectzx3]

i personally swear by Mobil-1. The best true synthetic for the money ....4.17 per qt. however, my ford dealer carries both Motorcraft 5-20 and 5-30 synthetic and the service tech told me its Mobil-1 rebadged and priced a little higher. 5-30 is fine ... most wear occurs at start-up in new motors. don't go with 10w-anything as its thicker at start up.... especially in winter. synthetic oils are without a doubt better than regular oil. how can that void a warranty? sounds like bullsh#t. let the rings seat with conventional oil til 6000 and go synthetic. find another dealer. also synthetic or not change your oil at 3000 mile intervals. today's oils can last longer but not the filters. incidenally the motorcraft fl-2005 is perhaps the best oil filter you can buy. also before wasting $ on a syn blend i would recommend castrol gtx 5-30 if you dont want to pay for a true synthetic.

[ 01-01-2002: Message edited by: projectzx3 ]</p>

[LastRites]

Motorcraft is a SEMI-SYNTH, in other words save yourself some money and get regular Dino if thats the route you want to go. I have used and fully trust M1 for many years. Just out of habit I switch to Synth at 6K, no data to support if thats good or bad but I dont loose oil either. Locally M1 in any weight its offered in can be had for $3.49 a quart and I've heard that some Wal Marts have been selling the 5 quart container in the neighborhood of $11.

[FlaFocus]

I'm running Castrol GTX 5W30 and I got it at WalMart

[Houckster]

I agree about using synthetic lubes . When I got my SVT, I switched to a full synthetic at 668 miles. There is nothing wrong with using a 5W30. The 5W20 recommendation should really be read as a minimum spec, that is, 5W or less on the bottom end and at least 20W on the top. I use a 5W50 full synthetic (not Syntec) and get great results. I don't believe 5W20 is protective enough with the Zetec engine.

I recommend against semi-synthetics. I think many people assume that they are 50% synthetic when in most cases, they are only 5-10% synthetic which isn't enough to provide any meaningful increase in protection.

Also: The rings on our Zetec engines are already "seated". The days when a light engine oil was used to facilitate the elimination of asperities is a thing of the past. Modern engines go through an extra machining step (I forget what the process is called.) which is necessary so the engine will meet emission standards when it leaves the factory. You can actually go synthetic as soon as you can get to your autoparts store. I have 4K on the synthetic I use now and I haven't burned a drop.

[99 ZX2 Sport]

I think many people assume that they are 50% synthetic when in most cases, they are only 5-10% synthetic...

According to my supplier, the Motorcraft 5W20 semi-synthetic oil does not have enough synthetic content
in it to have the word "synthetic" on the packaging
here in Canada....

[rheacer]

I don't see any reason not to go with syn if you have 10k, except added cost. If engine isn't broken in by now, it isn't going to.
Valvoline has a great explaination on their site. I tried running 10-30w in a race engine for SOLO I and kept losing pressure when oil got hot (200-210). Switched to 20-50w and no problem. In So Fl, I would think that would occur in stop-go traffic with ambient heat, and you would need 5-30w, or even 10-30w (how many nights do y'all have with temps under 32 degrees?). Thought...if you look in owner's manual, it says 7,500 changes with DINO oil. 3000 miles is hype by the folks that sell oil...what do you think they are going to recommend? IMHO

[BUR_ZX3]

7500 miles for an oil change if and only if you drive to work on an open country road 15 miles and you live in Sunny Arizona!

5000 Mile intervals with Synthetic for me and my stop-and-go LA Commuter Traffic works great!

As for switching to Syn from Dino Juice.... while technically the engine is "broken in" at the factory and we're supposed to be able to drive it hard off the showroom floor... I don't know that I trust that. First time I gave it 15000 miles.. then the engine blew... so I let the new one run 5000 miles and switched to the Syn.

3000 miles is marketing! Pure and simple! Mobil will say in one breath "Come to EZ lube every 3000 miles" and on their site profess that with Mobil 1 you can have peace of mind to go the full length of your recommended oil change interval.

Heres a good tidbit of info... http://www.mobil1.com/why/myths.jsp

[Houckster]

3K intervals may be a realistic estimate for dino oil and the cheap kind of filter most oil change joints supply. The Zetec engine is hard on filters and oil so I would probably go 3K miles if I were maintaining my car through Jiffy-Lube. A couple of trips in hot rush-hour traffic with the A/C on can really fry an oil. I read of tests where a perfectly good 5W30 dino oil was reduced to a 15W20 oil after a two hour session at 300 degrees. The Zetec will suffer with an oil in this condition.

The synthetics have the staying power the Zetec engine needs. Use a top quality filter. Amsoil is the best of the conventional synthetics (0W30 Amsoil 2000). Mobil 1 makes a good synthetic element filter.

The Zetec should not be run with 10W30 or 20W50 IMO. Stay with a 0-5W lower end and at least a 30W upper. All that's necessary is to buy an oil with the quality that's necessary.

[blueovalbaboon]

hey houckster did you read my post on the other oil topic here?

[Houckster]

I read your comments about PTFE on the permanent oil/coolant thread. I thought it was very interesting, especially since it seems to lend additional support for the use of a proper form of PTFE in automotive lubricants. Is this what you're referring to?

[vad]

The Zetec engine is hard on filters and oil...

How so?

A couple of trips in hot rush-hour traffic with the A/C on can really fry an oil. I read of tests where a perfectly good 5W30 dino oil was reduced to a 15W20 oil after a two hour session at 300 degrees. The Zetec will suffer with an oil in this condition.

A couple of trips??? Don't think so...

The synthetics have the staying power the Zetec engine needs.

Again, what's so special about the Zetec?

Amsoil is the best of the conventional synthetics (0W30 Amsoil 2000).

Are there uncoventional synthetics? Just wonder. And please be carefull throwing "the best" around.

The Zetec should not be run with 10W30 or 20W50 IMO. Stay with a 0-5W lower end and at least a 30W upper.

What's wrong with 10W30 in the mild climates all year long or during the summer time everywhere else?

[Houckster]

The Zetec engine is hard on filters and oil...

It is hard on oil because it is an emission controlled engine which uses heat to reduce emissions. I am not implying that the Zetec is unique in this property. The conventional dino oils on the market are not designed to last long and their additive package which costs typically less than 5 cents out of a purchase price of $1-$1.25 does not hold up against adverse conditions long. The tendency of oils to sludge up and form acids is a direct function of heat. Filters wind up holding a lot of sludge and can wind up going to bypass a lot sooner than most people expect. An increase of just 8 degrees in oil temperature will double its reactivity to blow-by gases. A couple of commutes in hot weather rush-hour traffic with the A/C will noticably deteriorate a conventional dino oil like Motorcraft 5W20, whether it be pure dino or a blend.

Amsoil is the best of the conventional synthetics (0W30 Amsoil 2000).

Implicit in my statements is that they are my opinion. If I had to choose between Mobil 1, Redline and Amsoil, I'd choose Amsoil. They are the only ones who believe enough in their oil to stand behind it for a full year.

The Zetec should not be run with 10W30 or 20W50 IMO. Stay with a 0-5W lower end and at least a 30W upper.

My comment is based on the Ford specs. Maybe I'm wrong but I've never seen them recommend a 10W30 for the Zetec. When Ford makes a recommendation such as 5W20, I read it as a minimum spec which means an oil 5W or lower at the bottom end and at least 20 at the top.

Consider, if you will, that dino oil is derived from the parts of a barrel of crude that cannot be converted cost-effectively to something for which a market exists. This lube oil basestock (API SA) is sold for cost to anyone willing to take delivery, Quaker State-Pennzoil for example, which then buys an additive package to make the oil suitable for use in modern engines. This oil is composed of carbon chains of various lengths, some short, some long. As you're probably aware, the shorter chains go to make gasoline, candle and baby oil. Longer chains make asphault and coke. It's the short chains which burn off more quickly during a hot day in traffic leaving the heavier oil behind. When oil deteriorates, the effective viscosity of the oil will generally increase. During a cold start what you have is a longer amount of time before the engine starts circulating oil and the slower the oil will circulate to reach critical areas like cam lobes. Therefore, it's my opinion that a 0W30 is better than a 10W30 for the Zetec. Yes, in a warmer climate you can get away with 10W30 but what would be the purpose? Since general opinion, which I share, is that wear occurs most when the engine is being started cold, it is in our interest to have the best cold engine lubrication performance possible.

[vad]

It is hard on oil because it is an emission controlled engine which uses heat to reduce emissions.

EGR?? If nothing else, it cools the cylinders by mixing the inert burnt gases with the fresh mixture.

The tendency of oils to sludge up and form acids is a direct function of heat. Filters wind up holding a lot of sludge and can wind up going to bypass a lot sooner than most people expect.

I wonder if you ever cut a used filter open? And if you did how much sludge did you find after 5K miles????

Going to bypass??? Hmm...
The filter needs to really clog up in order to switch into the by-pass mode. The Zetec is not a Toyota sludge monster. It doesn't create sludge during the normal oil change intervals.

During a cold start what you have is a longer amount of time before the engine starts circulating oil and the slower the oil will circulate to reach critical areas like cam lobes.

Cold start fluidity differences between 0W30, 5W30 and 10W30 are negligible unless you live in the very cold climate areas.
On the other hand to make the oil comply with the multi-viscosity standards the manufacturers add viscosity modifiers to the single weight basestocks.
The bigger the viscosity spread between the numbers separated by "W" - the more viscosity modifiers should be added. The more modifiers - the less stable oil.

And regarding the 3000 miles oil change intervals.
This article makes some very good points.

http://www.amsoil.com/lit/lng_article/march_lng_new.pdf

[Houckster]

EGR?? If nothing else, it cools the cylinders by mixing the inert burnt gases with the fresh mixture.

Yes, this is done to reduce ozone emissions typical of a very hot combustion condition. This does not contradict the proposition that modern emissions controlled engines are very hard on oil. Did you know that the lubricant manufacturers are 15 months behind schedule meeting the GF-4 lubricant standards? This is because it is tough to get a dino oil to stand up to the conditions inside a modern engine. It isn't even that easy for the synthetic guys.

I wonder if you ever cut a used filter open? And if you did how much sludge did you find after 5K miles????

I've seen it done. It can vary from almost total clogging with dino oil to nothing at all with a high quality synthetic.

Cold start fluidity differences between 0W30, 5W30 and 10W30 are negligible unless you live in the very cold climate areas.

Not over the course of 100K miles. There will be a difference. Remember that as a dino oil deteriorates, it gets thicker so you want to start with as low a viscosity as possible to provide against this. The initial performance of a dino oil doesn't last long. Send a sample of your dino oil into a good oil analysis firm and let them confirm that for you. You'll be unpleasantly surprised, especially if you're car is subjected to summer commuting conditions.

On the other hand to make the oil comply with the multi-viscosity standards the manufacturers add viscosity modifiers to the single weight basestocks.
The bigger the viscosity spread between the numbers separated by "W" - the more viscosity modifiers should be added. The more modifiers - the less stable oil.

Not necessarily true. As in most things, you can provide better additives if you charge more. At the $1-$1.25 level, you're not going to get the stability of an oil at the $4-7 level not to mention at the $30 level.

The Amsoil article does make some good points but not in contradiction to my arguments. If you asked Al Amatuzio what his recommendation for dino oil replacement intervals is, he might very well say 3K intervals were reasonable. He might even recommend lower than this if your goal is to get synthetic oil protection out of dino oil. The whole point of the article was to say that frequent oil changes are unnecessary with a good synthetic oil like Amsoil and I am in full agreement with this point. That's why I use SynLube.