Brake Pedal engages really high on the pedal after bleeding

[rallyrabbit]

Scenario. 2005 Focus ZX3 SE. All new rotors and drums within 2 months. Using Carbotech Bobcat pads on the front, and stock stuff on the rear.

Noticed about 4 weeks ago that i was getting some major brake noise on the front drivers side. Thought it was the pads never being at true operaitng temp, so I ignored until I noticed I had brake dust on the front drivers side and none on the passenger side. Thought it was strange.

Jacked the car up, and I could spin the tire (with real effort on my part) if the brake pedal was depressed. Thought it was strange, bled the brakes, that problem seemed to go away.

Now, my pedal engages near the top. Like, very close to the top. Never had a pedal engage that far up. And this only happened after I bled the front driver's side. I seem to have plenty of stopping power, but it just engages funny. It feels like the booster is working since if you depress the pedal and start the car the pedal will go down slightly.

Any opinions on things to try?

[orionlion82]

air in the lines?

[MichaelXi]

Any change in the dusting after bleeding?
Does the car Pull under braking if you release the wheel?

[rallyrabbit]

Originally Posted by MichaelXi

Any change in the dusting after bleeding?
Does the car Pull under braking if you release the wheel?

No, that's the weird thing. Seems to be even braking, but then, it seemed to be even braking when there was air in the lines before too.

I guess I will pull it all apart and bleed the whole system today or tomorrow.

[brads03zx3]

Sounds like there is no problem. You fixed the issue. An excellent braking system engages with minimal displacement. This means you probably had a lot of air in the system before hand, so that air was compressing before the caliper was effective causing a low pedal.

[Reza]

Originally Posted by brads03zx3

Sounds like there is no problem. You fixed the issue. An excellent braking system engages with minimal displacement. This means you probably had a lot of air in the system before hand, so that air was compressing before the caliper was effective causing a low pedal.

x2

[Johnny_P]

x3

If you really think there's a problem, you can take your wheels off and re-grease your slide pins... That should only take like an hour, and most of that time will be jacking the car and taking wheels off

[rallyrabbit]

Going to pull it all apart anyway today.

Noticed that the right front brake rotor is running way hotter than the passenger side. So either, I have a bad master cylinder distributing unequal pressure, something is in the line, or something is binding under pressure (because there is no binding when the brake pedal is off)

[TooStock]

Generally your shoe (meaning, rear drum brakes) adjustment effects your brake pedal height and travel. Set too tight you'll have a short pedal, set too loose and you'll have excessive travel.

[hEaT]

The rears are auto-adjusting correct?

[brads03zx3]

Yes, until they are changed. Once the shoes are replaced, the adjuster must be backed off.

[rallyrabbit]

Ok, so my pedal is still really frickin' high. It doesn't feel right still.

Here's what I've done between the last message and now:
-Pulled apart front brakes, inspected, greased pins and put back together
-Replaced front rubber brake lines
-ensured that shoes were adjusted (they aren't dragging)
-Bled the brake system 3 times
-No ABS, so that isn't a concern

So. The problem still occurs. I have about 1" of pedal travel, other focuses I have access to have about 3" of travel. The pedal is always firm, so there is never a loss of pressure (or it doesn't seem to be).

Observations:
-Front driver's side rotor is always running way hotter than passenger side. Water sizzles off this side. The other side is hot, but water quickly evaporates off rather than sizzle off.
-Since I don't feel a drop in pressure, I haven't considered the master cylinder to be the problem. Is that wrong?
-Could this be a vaccum or booster problem? Meaning, could I be running without the booster working somehow? If so, how can I test or tell if that is the case?

Any other recommendations?

[Stolle]

dont put water on ur hot rotors....good way to warp and crack them.

[brads03zx3]

Here, let me say this again:

Originally Posted by brads03zx3

Sounds like there is no problem.

As far as an early engaging pedal, you are complaining about a good thing. It's like saying "Recently, I haven't found any of my clothes or CD's in my little brother's room. He's even doing the chores that mom asks him to do. What's wrong? We took him to the doctor, but that stupid guy says he's healthy. What should I do?"

Both of my foci have firm pedals. This is because I don't wait 5 years to replace the brake fluid, the pads have plenty of material, and there is no air in the lines. In a perfect world, the pedal would not move at all. The brakes' effectiveness would only be a function of pedal pressure, and have nothing to do with pedal displacement. Unfortunately, materials flex, so the pedal usually moves. Your brakes are fine. Be happy




Now, if one side is hotter than the other (your experiment isn't very scientific, and can get expensive) this could be for several reasons. Does the car pull to one side under braking? If not, you again have nothing to worry about. If it does, you may have some debris in the line clogging one sid, or you may have a bad caliper, etc.

[rallyrabbit]

Originally Posted by Stolle

dont put water on ur hot rotors....good way to warp and crack them.

Yes, I know. We are talking a couple of drops from a dropper not a full blast of water from a hose.

[rallyrabbit]

Originally Posted by brads03zx3

Here, let me say this again:

As far as an early engaging pedal, you are complaining about a good thing. It's like saying "Recently, I haven't found any of my clothes or CD's in my little brother's room. He's even doing the chores that mom asks him to do. What's wrong? We took him to the doctor, but that stupid guy says he's healthy. What should I do?"

Both of my foci have firm pedals. This is because I don't wait 5 years to replace the brake fluid, the pads have plenty of material, and there is no air in the lines. In a perfect world, the pedal would not move at all. The brakes' effectiveness would only be a function of pedal pressure, and have nothing to do with pedal displacement. Unfortunately, materials flex, so the pedal usually moves. Your brakes are fine. Be happy

Ok, will some of your humor me. We you check and measure your brake pedal travel and at least tell me yours for comparison?

Originally Posted by brads03zx3

Now, if one side is hotter than the other (your experiment isn't very scientific, and can get expensive) this could be for several reasons. Does the car pull to one side under braking? If not, you again have nothing to worry about. If it does, you may have some debris in the line clogging one sid, or you may have a bad caliper, etc.

Nope, not scientific at all! Car does not pull to either side under braking. Drivers side doe s have more dust collected on the wheel the the passenger side.

[OmniFocus]

The less travel the better.... that's precisely why I have forged four-piston calipers and stainless steel brake lines. I *want* my pedal to feel like I'm stepping on a rock.

[Omega Anomaly]

I would have to agree with everyone. A good firm pedal with minimal travel is what you want. If you had a good amount of travel afteer you did the brakes, then there would be cause for concern. As far as the drivers side being hotter than the other, it is of no concern if the braking is not pulling to one side or the other, atleast you are getting equal brake pressure to both calipers and both calipers are working. There are only a couple things I can think of on why the one side maybe hotter than the other.
1. Possibly either the rotor thickness or brake pad thickness is a little more on the drivers side, which would go away with time.
2. Either the pins or the piston is not moving as freely as the pass side, slower recovery time from when the brake pedal is released.

Maybe you could have someone else push on the brake and let off and try to spin the wheel upon realease to see if there is some drag from a slow recovery.

[Johnny_P]

sometimes those slide pins get warped from overtorquing or overheating without grease.... They're like $5 a set from autozone though.... hey its a shot