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Discussion Starter #1
Saw this on the news tonight, and also on my yahoo! homepage. It was a video of a 9 year old girl shooting a full auto Uzi at a range in Arizona (Vegas area I guess). Anyway, she looses control and shoots the "instructor" in the head, kills him. :(

The reporter asked how young was too young to shoot full auto. I don't think there is/should be an age limit, but until the child is physically able to control the recoil they should not be able to.

My father taught me to shoot a .22 rifle (Ruger 10/22) when I was about 6. I was shooting his Iver Johnson Champion 20 ga and Ithaca Featherweight 12 ga by the time I was 8. Took the hunter safety course and was hunting with him by the time I was 12 or so, upland game only. Dad was never a deer hunter.

I taught a gal coworker of mine to shoot. Her mother is from Guam and she's about 5'5" and maybe 120 pounds, so not a real big girl. She wanted to shoot my S&W 629 .44 Magnum 8 3/8" bbl. I stood behind her and was ready to grab the gun if it came up to hit her in the face.

It didn't, and she was a natural shooter from the beginning - no bad habits to unlearn. Started with my .22 target pistol and shot both my .357's, .40 S&W auto pistol, 1911 .45, and my Ruger Single Six convertible (.22 LR and .22 WMR). She said the one that felt most uncomfortable to her was the .40. Recoil was "too much" and the grip and bigger than what she could comfortably palm.

So, what do you all say about this tragedy? Not trying to get into a second amendment debate, or a full auto debate either, so no flames please.
 

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****ney-4-Life!
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My feelings on guns are well known around these here parts...


So I'll leave it there.

And who in their right mind doesn't stand behind the muzzle?? Even when instructing.
 

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Terrible. First thing that jumps into my head is Forrest Gump quote....


Sent via poles, wires and telegraph 2.
 

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And who in their right mind doesn't stand behind the muzzle?? Even when instructing.
That's the trouble with very small full auto weapons. The muzzle starts in one place and ends entirely in another. I have shot several full auto weapons, including a .40 cal glock with a ~30 round mag. I'm a somewhat experienced shooter and much stronger than a 9 year old girl, but the only reason I didn't fly any bullets over the backstop was by letting off the trigger after only a few rounds. Totally uncontrollable in an way, and by far the most fun I've ever had firing a gun.

I absolutely can see how this accident happened, and it's really awful. Safety is (should be!) the number once concern when operating a firearm and another innocent gun claimed a life.
 

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Instructor standing over a tiny girl with an Uzi on full auto ~ Ward walking around on a hot track stalking Tony Stewart... death waits near mis-judgement.

It's a shame, the little girl will either never want to shoot a handgun again, or will be talked into being a sociopath.



:facepalm: Guns are no more "innocent" than they are "guilty".
 

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Inebriated Pecker Obstructionist
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I haven't read anything other than headlines, but that was enough for me to *facepalm* because a 9yr old had an automatic weapon, that is unstable at best when the trigger is held down. I've never shot anything that was full auto before, but I've seen more than a few times where a full auto like an Uzi only stops because it's out of ammo. Muzzle kick lifts while adrenaline says OH ****, SON!!! HOLD ON TIGHT!!!
 

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From what I understand an Uzi is hard for a full grown adult to handle, handing one to a kid is pure stupidity. Same scenario killed a kid a few years ago.

Only thing I've ever fired full auto was an original MP-44 Sturmgewehr at a WW2 reenactment set up to fire blanks and even with all that weight the muzzle wanted to climb.

-Steve
 

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Nobody has an issue with the law preventing people under the age of 16 from operating a car; I feel its is not far-fetched to have a similar law at the same age in place for automatic weaponry.
I'd trust a 15 year old kid who's 6' tall and 300 lbs with an uzi over a 90 year old lady who's 5' and 90 lbs
 

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I'd trust a 15 year old kid who's 6' tall and 300 lbs with an uzi over a 90 year old lady who's 5' and 90 lbs
I don't want that old lady driving a car either. I think Cobra is on a rational line of thinking... we need to limit certain things, and it's up to us (collectively) to figure out the fairest legal way to do that. There should be minimum and maximum ages for doing things in public that are inherently dangerous to others... that's one place to start.
 

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"Lifes like a box of chocolates"??
Close mate!

Why do I suspect that this started with the statement, "I better teach my kids about gun safety"...

Mission acompli...

All I was allowed to operate when I was 9 was a bolt action single shot .22 short, I worked my way up to a .410 shotgun, .22 long single shot, .20 gauge side by side, .303 rifle bolt action, over a span of 5 years.

I lost interest before I tried to get any more creative. UZI? That's unbelievable negligent, dangerous and incontrovertibly stupid. If this wasn't already a complete tragedy, I'd hope someone would get their amendment revoked.
Sent via poles, wires and telegraph 2.
 

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That's the trouble with very small full auto weapons. The muzzle starts in one place and ends entirely in another. I have shot several full auto weapons, including a .40 cal glock with a ~30 round mag. I'm a somewhat experienced shooter and much stronger than a 9 year old girl, but the only reason I didn't fly any bullets over the backstop was by letting off the trigger after only a few rounds. Totally uncontrollable in an way, and by far the most fun I've ever had firing a gun.

I absolutely can see how this accident happened, and it's really awful. Safety is (should be!) the number once concern when operating a firearm and another innocent gun claimed a life.
There's no way the range instructor was behind her. I totally understand how uncontrollable it would be...Uzis are actually quite heavy for their size to begin with. But I seriously doubt this girl spun 180 degrees. The dude was next to her, and that was stupid. I'm no range instructor but I taught my son how to shoot and worked with several coworkers to practice before predeployment qualifications, and I ALWAYS stand behind them. I have no interest in getting flagged, and from behind them I have a chance to stop them from pointing the gun somewhere besides downrange. If I'm next to the shooter, they can turn before I can stop them.

Maybe this will help lighten the mood a bit?
 

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Discussion Starter #17
The news report showed the instructor standing on the non-gun side, next to and behind her. Even the range owner said he should have been behind the girl on the gun side, with one hand on her back and the other ready to control the weapon if she couldn't.

Oh yeah, that DEA agent video is a classic! Just proves what I've always thought about Glocks. Don't care for the trigger mounted safety - it cuts into my trigger finger and doesn't prevent accidental discharge if the trigger I pulled. The little girl's voice at the end when he says "This is an M16" and she screams "Put it down!" is great!!
 

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Guns are no more "innocent" than they are "guilty".


One of 'yours' John?
Yesir, I pulled that one right out of my...

scrapbook of most prized sayings. ;)
 

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I
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The news report showed the instructor standing on the non-gun side, next to and behind her. Even the range owner said he should have been behind the girl on the gun side, with one hand on her back and the other ready to control the weapon if she couldn't.
This.

Age has nothing to do with it, instructor was at fault here unfortunately. RIP. A 21yr old kid with no experience could very well have ended the same way if the physical strength wasn't there.
 
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